Inside My New 2 Day Business Intensive (& Open House)

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This week on the Sunlight Tax Podcast, I talk about why expert guidance and community support can make it easier to navigate business structure, tax compliance, and the behind-the-scenes systems that keep a small business running smoothly.

I’m also introducing my new business program designed to help self-employed business owners get the tax, bookkeeping, and legal side of their business properly set up. If you’re starting, growing, or tuning up a small business and want more clarity around your taxes, bookkeeping, and legal setup, this episode is for you.

Also mentioned in today’s episode:

00:10 Introduction to the new business program

02:17 Details of the upcoming open house events

04:00 Overview of the two-day intensive program

05:17 Program benefits: legal, tax, and bookkeeping

06:32 Beta cohort details and early access

07:36 First official cohort schedule and content

08:23 Value of expert guidance and personalized support

09:45 One-on-one coaching and group community

11:06 Building connections and support networks

12:04 How to join and questions answered

If you enjoyed this episode, please rate, review and share it! Every review makes a difference by telling Apple or Spotify to show the Sunlight Tax podcast to new audiences.

Episode Links:

Register to my Open Houses on 9/9:

• Open House (AM) - 9:30am

• Open House (PM) - 4:30pm

Loom video walkthrough about the Intensive

Learn more about the Intensive

Link to join the program: 

• link to join the First Official Cohort (9/23 & 9/24). Investment is $1850

• link to join the Beta Cohort (9/23 & 9/24). Investment is $1275

Get my Tax Help on Substack

Watch the YouTube video version

Transcript:

Hannah Cole (00:07)

Hello beautiful. I hope you're doing well.

I have been head down building a new platform a piece of software and program after spending many months doing client interviews and market research and frankly just kind of taking the foot off the gas in my own business to just like assess where things are at right now. it can be a hard thing to do that in business.

Hard to just slow down, but sometimes life just shows you that it is the only way forward. and that certainly was true for me. But what I want to talk to you about today is now that the program is built, and now that I am filling the cohorts, the first available cohort is ready to go. and I'm just super excited about the program. So I just want to

Tell you a little bit about what it is, why I made it, and just give you some info on if you want to learn more about it, if you're interested in it and you want to come to an open house. I will be hosting an open house this Wednesday. That's tomorrow, if you're listening on the day the podcast drops, at 9 30 a.m. Eastern and another one at 4 30 p.m. Eastern. So 9 30 a.m. Eastern, which is 12 30 p.m.

Pacific and 4 30 p.m. Eastern, which is 1 30 Pacific. So I welcome you to come, this will just be really short and sweet, just 30 minutes, so that you can actually see physically inside this like clean, simple, gorgeous piece of software and how easy it is to find things and just ask a tax question and watch it bring you exactly to me giving that answer.

it's one of the things I feel the most proud of because I know that a lot of us want that convenience and that like customized I just want to ask whatever tax question I have at any moment. But the problem is AI doesn't have a tax license. AI doesn't have any due diligence requirement. AI is perfectly free and absolutely does give you tax law that is six months out of date. so the numbers are wrong. that is a literal example. that just happened to me.

it's not that great at the tax math.

I notice only because I will enter the same problem multiple days in a row and notice that it gives me different answers on different days. and of course the whole time it's telling you it's confidently that it's correct. And how would you know? How would you know if you didn't know the mistake it made and what that was based on? Because you go through the math yourself and check it, which I've done.

So, this searchable tax database from me, a licensed tax pro, to me, this is one of the most valuable things that you get to keep after joining the program. I'm super excited about it. But let me tell you a little bit more about just what the program is. what it is is just a short and sweet, two-day intensive where you get really the most amount of time you can possibly ever get with me.

available in a very, very small cohort, right? So you get lots of individual attention and you will get the tax, bookkeeping, and legal side of your business properly set up in just two days, right? You will walk away. The focus is on building, on doing. But of course, I'm there to answer any question that you have as we do it. And the idea is that I don't want you to feel overwhelmed or alone. I want to be there doing it with you.

Right. And you're going to be in a very small cohort who's also doing it, who can be there for that little bit of accountability. I know you may need that. I certainly do. And over two days you'll be working with me. I'm a licensed tax professional. You probably know if you've listened to this podcast, to get your tax tracking organized, calculate your next quarterly tax payment, improve your bookkeeping setup with Tax Smart Ninja Tricks.

And determine which business licensing, insurance, and tax requirements actually apply to you. You won't leave this program with another list of things to figure out. You will leave with an actual setup that you trust. All right. So I welcome your questions. If you have any questions about that, definitely click the link to join one of those two open houses tomorrow in the show notes.

there's a link to join the program itself if this sounds good and you just needed a reminder. But I'm very open to having a call with you, to answering your questions in the open house. I would love to kind of make sure that you feel really held and understand what you will get in this program. it is absolutely possible because the timeline is short, the beta launch.

the beta test group is happening Monday. Monday, September fourteenth. Because that's at short notice and because not everybody in the world is going to be available on Monday the fourteenth and Wednesday the sixteenth, the two days of the intensive. I imagine the beta cohort is going to be extremely small and you may be getting my full attention in a group of like two or three people. So it is

That one might be the best deal available ever. If you don't know what a beta means in this world, what it means is when you're a beta, it's actually the launch before the launch, right? You're actually sort of a test run, a test pilot. And so typically for a beta, and certainly for mine, you can join the program and it is the full program, soup to nuts, but at a substantial discount.

But the expectation is that you will be giving feedback and testimonials to help me make adjustments to pieces of the software that have a bug or felt confusing. So you're understanding that your experience will be as a test pilot and there may be some kinks that are still getting worked out the very first time this runs.

So if that appeals to you, if you're that kind of person who wants to be the early adopter, wants to be first in line, that is starting those dates for that cohort are September 14th and 16th, 11 a.m. to 5 p.m. East Coast time, which is 8 to 2 Pacific. I tried to pick a time that is doable during daytime hours, no matter what time zone you're We will actually touch on sales tax, we will touch on tax entities.

We're gonna be digging into some special tracking that's just gonna make your tax time open up with ease. And there is a guest teacher coming in to teach bookkeeping. So it's a really exciting program. I'm super, super happy about it.

The official, the first official cohort, so not the beta group, but the first official group is happening the week after that on Wednesday and Thursday, September 23rd and 24th. Again, 11 a.m. to 5 p.m. Eastern, 8 to 2 Pacific. so if you are interested in being part of the first official cohort, there is a link to join that in the show notes.

There's also a link to join the beta, but I want you to understand what the difference is between those two and why the beta costs less than the first official cohort. I want to tell you that the value of this program is really incredible because it covers a lot of the legal ground, a lot of the setup, a lot of the accounting that you really cannot get without sitting down with a lawyer.

and an accountant and also a bookkeeper. So it's really kind of packing a punch and showing you where those aspects overlap so that you can walk away with a good setup that you trust without having to, you know, talk to a lawyer or an accountant who's talking down to you or judging you. The point here is that it's a really warm, safe, private environment with tons of personal attention where you're going to learn a bunch but implement.

primarily okay and you get a resource library so that you can always continue to ask questions as much as you want that are vetted tax answers. also what comes with the intensive are two one-on-ones with me. Certainly in the first two rounds that I run there will be two. I might drop one of them to be perfectly honest with you. So this may be the best deal you ever get.

which is why joining early is a great idea because it's probably gonna be the least full, the more more attention from me, smallest cohorts, and the most one-on-one time. you'll start with a one-on-one private session with me where you can ask me anything you want about your taxes, your setup, your entity choice, anything at all that you want to do right away, right? And then you start the intensive already with a bunch answered and clarified.

So that you're really kind of hitting the ground running. There's also a couple short lessons that you can review if you want to so that you already kind of know where you're at as we sit down in the first session. There's a follow-up one-on-one that happens afterwards. And this is just to check in and see how it's going. How did your setup work out? How are you feeling about how is it operating now?

I want you to feel really good about it, and so I want to give you the chance to ask me questions after the intensive to see if anything you know feels buggy or you're unsure about, right? The point is really for you to walk away with total confidence. And lastly, the thing that I feel personally the most excited about is just how cohesive the group will become. There is a piece.

inside the software where you can see everybody who's in the program, their picture, a little bit about their business and how they operate, a little bit about them as a person, so you can get to know them. And we also kick off the program with a cocktail hour or a coffee or mocktail. Bring whatever you like. But we kick it off with a social hour so that you get to know each other in a low-key way that has no tax info exchanged.

And you just get to know each other as humans because you're gonna be working side by side and holding each other accountable. And it's really my hope because the audience for my work here at Sunlight Tax is so beautiful, is so kind and supportive and driven by making the world a better place that I just want you to know each other and I want you to find each other and feel each other's support because I suspect you're gonna walk away from this program.

With a new friend with a new support network. And I don't know about you, but just leaning into people is what I want these days. I want more humanity and less AI. So that's a little bit about the program. If you want to see a video walkthrough, I'm linking in the show notes here, a Loom video walkthrough of the program itself. So you can just right now click into the show notes and see inside. I very much encourage you to come.

To the open house I'm hosting tomorrow, either the one at 9 30 Eastern or at 4 30 Eastern. These are just 30 minutes, super brief, in and out, but you can just show up, look around, see inside, ask me any questions, make sure that you really understand like what you'll be getting, what's on the agenda, how it works, because you'll be really surprised at how effective it is in setting up all those tricky parts of your business to allow you the focus to actually.

Forget about those things for the rest of the year. They'll be set and you can forget them. And now you can just do all those other things that you have on your plate in your business and go serve your people to the best of your abilities. All right, that's what I want for you. All right, lots of links in today's show notes. You can check out that Loom video of the program. You can join either the beta cohort or the first official cohort. You can join an open house to ask me questions, see inside.

and you can always send me an email, hello@sunlighttax.com if you have any questions for me, or send me a DM on Instagram @sunlighttax. I would love to hear what is holding you back, what you're concerned about, what you're wondering if it covers, if it's a fit for you or not. this is absolutely no pressure from me. This is really to make you know exactly what you're getting, what you walk away with, and feel good about it. All right.

I'll see you next week and maybe I'll see you tomorrow in the open house. Bye.

Your September Estimated Tax Payment: Tips On Making It Easier

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This week on the Sunlight Tax Podcast, I’m breaking down estimated quarterly taxes for self-employed people, freelancers, creatives, and small business owners. I’ll explain how bookkeeping helps you calculate your tax payments more accurately, avoid surprises, and stay on top of your federal and state tax obligations throughout the year.

I’m also introducing my new intensive program for self-employed business owners who want to get the tax, bookkeeping, and legal side of their business properly set up. 

Also mentioned in today’s episode:

00:10 Introduction and importance of quarterly tax payments

02:23 Understanding quarterly tax payments for self-employed

05:05 How to estimate your tax liability based on profit to date

08:04 Simplifying bookkeeping and estimated tax payments

10:44 Working with a licensed tax professional versus AI

12:31 Details of the two-day program and what participants will learn

14:16 Program features: database, private consultations, and setup

16:04 Upcoming cohort dates and how to join the waitlist

17:25 Building trust and transparency in business setup

18:19 Reminder to pay estimated taxes and get bookkeeping in order

If you enjoyed this episode, please rate, review and share it! Every review makes a difference by telling Apple or Spotify to show the Sunlight Tax podcast to new audiences.

Episode Links:

Watch my walkthrough video on how to pay your Estimated Quarterly Taxes

Join the 2-Day Business Setup Intensive Waitlist

Get my Tax Help on Substack

Get your FREE visual guide to tax deductions

Order my book:Taxes for Humans: Simplify Your Taxes and Change the World When You’re Self-Employed

Watch YouTube video version

Transcript:

Hannah Cole (00:07)

Hello beautiful. I hope everything is good in your world. I am coming to you after a day of playing hooky. I had my anniversary yesterday, and my partner and I took the day off and went for a hike, and it was just absolutely delightful. And then we saw my friend speak about her work. she has a nonprofit called the Lotus Campaign, which is worth checking out.

it's really cool. She's using market-based sort of like urban planning principles and market-based solution to homelessness. and the model is proving to really work and become scalable. So that was really fun, and I'm feeling refreshed and ready to jump into tax world and a busy fall season. So

What I want to talk to you about today is just a little short and sweet, practical reminder. The quarterly tax deadline, the third one of the year, is coming up in just a couple weeks. September 15th is the third estimated quarterly tax deadline of the year. does that mean, right? If you are a small business owner, you are meant to be paying your taxes every quarter.

It's really important that you do this. For those of us who are not employees, when we're self-employed, it is actually the tax system requires that we make tax payments throughout the year on a quarterly basis. So it's a much more forgiving pace than employees have because employees are paying their taxes through withholding on their paychecks every two weeks, every single time that they get paid.

And of course, that's lovely because it's so much less painful because they never you never see it. It never goes into your bank account and then has to leave again. So it can feel so much more onerous when you work for yourself. And it's why I spend a lot of my time and focus on teaching people how to track, calculate, and manage their estimated quarterly taxes. It's a really hard learning curve and it's not your fault.

There is no tax education in this country, right? We are not taught how to do this. Or even that this law exists and applies to us, right? So a lot of people are really surprised when they start a new business. Like, wait, what do I have to do? I'm sorry, I was supposed to be paying my taxes all through the year. I thought I paid on April 15th. And then as a tax practitioner, you have to say, no, you actually have penalties due because you weren't paying throughout the year. So

I'm coming here as a PSA to you to remind you that September 15th is coming up. It is the third deadline of the tax year 2026. It is when you are meant to make your third estimated quarterly tax payment based on 2026 income. So this is real-time income. you're paying tax on your profit in your business.

And you owe not just income tax on that, but you also owe self-employment tax. Self-employment tax for those who need a refresher, and don't we all, is 15.3% of the profit from your business. Okay. And that goes to Medicare and Social Security, whereas income tax goes to all the other stuff. Okay. So you owe both layers of that on your profit from your business and you owe it each quarter.

Now, of course, one of the tricky parts is you don't have a crystal ball. You don't yet know exactly what your tax rate for the year is going to be because you don't know how much money you're gonna make for 2026 until 2026 is over, right? This is the hard part, and it's the part that's really hard to get your head around, right? Wait, I don't know my tax rate. How do I pay the right amount? We get a little too hung up on paying the right amount.

And missing the boat that it is an estimate. It's called an estimate because you can only estimate. You actually can't get closer than an estimate because you don't have a crystal ball. You don't know the future. You don't know yet what your profit for 2026 will be. You only know what your profit to date is in 2026. So that is a very good way to make the calculation based on your profit to date. And that is usually what I recommend.

Though not always. So this is your PSA, and technically the rules say by the third deadline of the year, you should have paid to date 75% of the total tax that you'll owe for 2026. Now, again, not to freak out too much, there's leeway in this system on purpose. It's called an estimate, and they mean that, because you don't know exactly what your tax will be. So you are taking 75% of X.

Right? 75% of a number you have an idea about, but you're not gonna get precisely to the dollar. So it's less about fussing over the exact amount and more about making sure you get a payment that's pretty close in on time, and that's September 15th. All right. So

What you need in place to be able to pay your taxes every quarter, which you have to do when you are self-employed, when you run your own business. You need a system that's tracking your profit, right? In other words, bookkeeping. Now, this doesn't mean you actually need to go buy fancy bookkeeping software, though that might be appropriate. You might want it, right? A lot of us, for example, let's say you are a creative in tech.

Right. You work in the tech world and you left your job in tech to go out on your own full time. Well, for you, it may be that you don't actually need to set up complete bookkeeping on bookkeeping software and be paying that, you know, $50 monthly fee for your bookkeeping software. You may be just fine.

if you're freelance like that, you may be just fine going and doing it all on a spreadsheet, right? All you really need to know is your income from the business, your expenses from the business, take the difference, that is your profit, and you just make a calculation based on that. It's not rocket science, but it's very important that you do it. The more dialed in you get your bookkeeping, the better your estimates will be.

And the easier your tax time will be, the less headache you will have close to April 15th, because you will have been paying more accurately throughout the year, you'll have less reconciliation to do. And hopefully, if you have some special ninja tricks built into your bookkeeping, you will have an easier time just not having to go back and recalculate certain tax categories because you track them from the beginning.

Okay, this is one of the things that I like to teach because you can really save a lot of effort by a little bit of upfront work to kind of get your tracking a little more dialed in. So the takeaway here is bookkeeping doesn't need to be complicated, estimated tax paying does not need to be complicated, but they are both necessary and you need something. Okay. So if you take nothing else away today, that's a pretty good takeaway.

And I also have a video on my YouTube channel, and I'll link to it in today's show notes that shows you just a walkthrough video that I made on YouTube to show you literally screenshot by screenshot me paying my estimated taxes on the IRS website so that you know which buttons to click on that website because navigating it can feel a little bit tricky sometimes. So just click the show notes to get that video. It's a really nice walkthrough and it will help you. Okay.

so you gotta pay your quarterly taxes every quarter when you're self-employed. You need to be paying quarterly taxes. You need to have some bookkeeping set up. And it's even more helpful if you can dial it in so you track your tax categories with a little more precision to prevent recalculating a tax time and to basically keep things even smoother and even tighter. So if you're curious, I'm starting a new thing.

Right. I have been building over the summer, actually with my partner who is a software engineer. So we have a pretty sweet backend built. It's kind of incredible to have my own dev working on this. but we have been building a new program. and I'm doing a two-day intensive. So this is a two-day intensive for self-employed business owners who are making money.

But still aren't sure the business behind the scenes is set up correctly. All right. You will get the tax, bookkeeping, and legal side of your business properly set up in just two days. All right. and the point is to do it without feeling overwhelmed or alone. So this is a cohort experience. You will get to know the other people in the cohort. They are very wonderful, kind, like-minded small business owners like you.

and we'll be working. This is not just me teaching, this is work sessions in addition to teaching, and you will actually walk away with stuff set up. Okay. So over two days you'll be working with a licensed tax professional. That's me. And why is that so important? I I just want to highlight the fact that I have a license, I have due diligence requirements, I am required by my license to keep up with current tax law.

These are things that are not true of AI. I know a lot of you are asking your tax questions of AI, and I get it. I absolutely understand why that is so tempting. But I do just want to say I am a licensed tax professional, which means I actually have to do the due diligence to give answers that are correct. I do not hallucinate tax law the way that AI actually does.

And I have several examples of this. I have

Put in a tax problem one day and it gives me a certain answer of how much the tax savings would be. I put in the exact same problem the next day and got a different number, right? I also have had the experience of putting into Claude AI a tax problem. And I have the expertise to have done that math on my own.

And Claude's math came out different from my math. And so I went through and I checked line by line by line to find where the error was from Claude. And what I discovered was Claude was using the wrong tax law. I'm a licensed professional and I'm not allowed to do that. But Claude is allowed to do that. It's allowed to tell you the wrong answer on your taxes. So I do want to just highlight and underline that. While maybe asking some more general questions from AI is fine.

Specific tax questions that you can actually rely on, that still belongs in the zone of somebody with a license like myself. Okay, so in this intensive, over the two days you'll be working with a licensed, real-life human tax professional, which is me, to get your tax tracking organized, to calculate your next quarterly tax payment, and to improve your bookkeeping setup. Okay, so you can come as you are.

With your bookkeeping never having been set up at all, having been set up, but maybe completely messy and you're not really sure where things are. or maybe bookkeeping that you feel fine about and you just wanna tune it up and make it better, right? And we're gonna also determine, you're gonna determine in this two-day period which business licensing, insurance, and tax requirements actually apply to you.

So this is not just general advice. Again, the way that AI might give, or the way that, you know, a seminar to a huge array of people that are not self-employed, that are not solo businesses. This is gonna give you the answers at your scale, as a business of one, as a business that is not venture-backed, that is not raising equity, but a business that is bootstrapped, that is self-funded.

Where you maybe don't have like endless venture money to burn through. You have to actually watch your pennies and not just go out and get every bell and whistle that is available to you accounting-wise, but you're kind of concerned about making sure it's the right size for you and protects you and is what you need, but is not more than what you need. Okay. You won't leave this.

two-day session with another list of things to figure out, you will leave with a setup that you can trust. I think that's a pretty cool program. Tell me what you think. I'm really excited about it. It's brand new. It comes with a searchable database of me answering tax questions. So you can actually ask questions and you get to keep this. You can search the database, ask your questions, and it will point you to the place where I am giving the answer.

So that it won't hallucinate. Okay. It's gonna be a tax catalog where you can just find the answers to your questions in a way that you can trust. In a way that won't hallucinate. There's also one-on-one time. Now, this program is evolving. At the moment, I'm offering two one-on-one consults when you join this. you'll get one private consult with me before the two-day intensive, and you'll also get a private consult with me after.

So this is to make sure on the way in you're ready to go. You have prepared anything you need to, that any kind of snags that come up or any sort of like initial questions are answered right away, that you don't have to wait to ask your burning question. And also a one-on-one consult at the end, I think is important too, a little bit later, a little bit after the intensive.

To just make sure that everything has settled in well. Like, how's it going? How's it working? Any lingering questions, any hangups, any snags? So it'll do a little bit of troubleshooting afterwards as well. So you get to really feel good that you are getting a setup that works for you. I'm super excited about this program. I cannot wait to run my first cohort, and I'm excited to announce to you that I do have dates now. So the first beta.

Cohort is going to be September 14th and 16th. Those are the days. If you're curious about the hours, it's 11 to 5 East Coast time. So that's 8 to 2 Pacific. Those days will be pretty intense, but you're going to leave with a lot done. That's the beta group. And then the first official cohort goes the week after that, September 23rd and 24th. Also 11 to 5 p.m. East Coast time. So 8 to 2.

Pacific time. I'm so excited. If you want to join the wait list, it's not a commitment. You can join the wait list and never join. But if you're just interested, you want to know when they open. I should be opening signups by the end of this week, if all goes according to plan. So you can join the wait list at sunlighttax.com/intensive. Okay. you'll be the first to know when those spots are actually available.

I will warn you that I do have a number of people on the wait list now, probably enough to fill both cohorts. I'm keeping the cohorts very small and very tight. you're gonna get to know the people in the cohort, you're gonna get individual attention, and you know, it'll become your business buds that you can call on later on and stay in touch with. Yeah, so I'm super excited about this program.

I'm excited to be building a brand new thing. I'm trying to be transparent about my process here on my newsletter and in my podcast so that you can kind of be on this journey with me as I build a new thing to meet you where you're at today in today's world of overwhelm, info overwhelm, and also low trust. You know, I want you to feel really, really good that you are getting answers that are vetted from a tax professional and you know that you can trust them.

And that you build a setup that is really right for you, really individualized. Your questions are answered and you know it will work. So super excited about this intensive. Again, if you want to get on the wait list and be notified when those limited spots open up, it's going to be first come, first serve. you can go to sunlighttax.com/intensive. I really hope to hear what you have to think.

Hear you have to say about that program. If it sounds good to you, if you have questions, I absolutely welcome you to just ask anything that's on your mind. Will it do this? Will it do this? What if it doesn't work for me? What if I need it? You know, I'm not ready in September, but I'm hoping for November. Just let me know because I'm keeping lists. And yes, I do plan to offer this again, but the dates that I have available now are for September. All right, go forth, pay your third.

Estimated quarterly tax payment of the year by September 15th. It's time to get your bookkeeping going. Make sure you know your profit for the quarter in order to be able to make that payment. And I'll see you next week. Bye.

The Zen Journey of Small Business

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This week on the Sunlight Tax Podcast, I’m sharing personal lessons from running a small business and exploring what it means to build a business that supports your life. 

I talk about aligning business goals with your values, protecting your mental health, practicing ethical accountability, and embracing the spiritual side of entrepreneurship while giving practical insights on negotiation, feedback, decision-making, and navigating external challenges while staying grounded in what matters most. 

Also mentioned in today’s episode:

00:10 Introduction to Hannah Cole's journey and insights

01:48 Aligning goals with personal life and values

04:04 Small business as a spiritual and ethical journey

07:06 The importance of mental health and self-care

10:07 Receiving and managing feedback effectively

13:02 Negotiation strategies and contract clarity

16:55 Understanding external forces like economic shifts

20:04 The role of happiness and fulfillment in business

23:08 Ethics and accountability in client relationships

30:10 Building a sustainable and responsible business

32:58 Upcoming offerings and closing thoughts

If you enjoyed this episode, please rate, review and share it! Every review makes a difference by telling Apple or Spotify to show the Sunlight Tax podcast to new audiences.

Episode Links:

Join the 2-Day Business Setup Intensive Waitlist

Check out my program, Money Bootcamp

Get my Tax Help on Substack

Get your FREE visual guide to tax deductions

Order my book:Taxes for Humans: Simplify Your Taxes and Change the World When You’re Self-Employed

Watch YouTube video version

Transcript:

Hannah Cole (00:07)

Hello, beautiful. I want to bring you something on the personal side today. I've had some feedback from various listeners of the podcast and just of my writing in general, that anytime I bring up the importance of running a small ethical business, it feels like fuel for you. And in that spirit, I thought, we all could use that. Who couldn't use a little fuel, a little fire?

For the hard work that you do when you are a solo practitioner, right? It's just hard. Everything falls on you when you are running a small business and you are the only owner or you are a full-time freelancer. it's a lot already to just do the work that you are doing, whether it is a service, a product, and on top of that, you have all of the admin, all of the marketing, all of the sales.

It's really challenging and it can feel so overwhelming that it it just it's my passion to support people like this, right? And why? In part because I am one and I really understand in my bones how hard it is, but also how rewarding on the side of just serving people that you really care about, seeing them flourish in the world. There's really nothing more gratifying than doing that and just feeling the pride of like.

I helped build that. I helped make that stronger. You know, it feels so good. So I just want to speak to you. If you are struggling in the trenches of freelance work, maybe you're even new to full time self employment. I know I've been speaking to a lot of people in the tech industry, designers in tech, some of whom have been laid off and so are making a forced transition into full time.

freelance contract work and some people who are starting their own businesses at this point. My own partner is one of these people. And it's a scary transition. So I just want to give you some words of encouragement today. Talk about, you know, I'm gonna be real about how difficult the journey can be and it is. It is hard. But it's hard in the way that weight training is hard. It's rewarding. There is something you get out of it.

And let's not forget that part. So this is my episode today on the Zen journey of small business. I wrote a newsletter this week that talked about small business ego death. And that's a little exaggerated. Of course, it's a very headline-y thing to say. and I hope nobody took that in a super literal way, thinking that, you know, things are that dire for me. They're not.

But definitely I feel that my own voyage as a small business owner, and man, it's been an evolution. that running a small business has been one of the most spiritual journeys of my life. And I know that sounds incredibly ironic and strange in our capitalist culture.

Especially if you're coming from a part of the world, whether it's the nonprofit world, the arts world, the creative world, maybe the healing world, where you feel a little adverse to capitalism, you're not so sure it's for the good. and I I just want to I just want to say that I actually see a way and feel very personally that small scale, accountable capitalism.

can really transform people in a positive way, that it's wonderful. I do want to be clear. I see a version of capitalism, I think we all do, that is metastasized, unregulated, unchecked, unfettered, and doing way too powerful with way too little accountability. And that is not what I'm talking about. I too am skeptical of that, feel very negative feelings about things like that.

But what I am talking about when I see the positive side, it's people like you. It's small practitioners, small businesses that have accountability to the people that they serve. They are accountable for what's in their products, for how they pay their workers, for how they serve their clients, right? When you are that way, there's a beautiful cycle where you offer something to someone that is.

More valuable to them than the dollars you charge. And that is the value that they get out of the thing that you offer. That's kind of a beautiful concept, right? And if you do a terrible job, if you treat them terribly, if you give them a product that makes them sick, they will never buy from you again. And that's a good thing. That's accountability. Like part of the important part here is that you need to really show up and serve people well, right?

And when you do that, like the people who are doing that, that's the people that I serve and that's who I love. That's actually the part of capitalism, the part of small business that I really want to help perpetuate in this world. Cause I think this is where good is done, right? So with that said, let me talk about some of the ways that I see running a small business as a bit of a spiritual journey and just share with you some of my wisdom gained.

in 10 years as a small business owner. Technically, I've had maybe 25 years of being a small business owner because in my life before starting Sunlight Tax, I was and I still am a professional artist, and that also is running a small business. one with, you know, some real sticky feelings about capitalism. But now I'm much more squarely in the

In the zone of small business and capitalism. And so let's let's talk about it. Okay. So, first, I want to say when you are the only owner of your business, your mental health is the company's health. And so taking your mental health seriously, taking the health of your body seriously, actually is a pretty important thing to do in terms of your business success. I'm coming to you as a person who

moves my body every day, who's gotten quite serious about weight training in the last few years. I want to be around for a long time. I want to be healthy. And I also, you know, honestly, I've been through some really hard things in the last few years. you know, the devastation of Hurricane Helene and what that did to me. and also just some shifts in the market, shifts in my client, just a lot of change all at once.

at a time that, you know, because of my loss in Helene is not the easiest time for me personally. And so focusing in on my mental health and what I need to be healthy has meant to slow down at sunlight tax, right? And I would say it came at the expense of sunlight tax, but that's actually not true. Slowing down is actually the fastest way to recover for me because

I actually was getting to a point where I felt so burnt out, so depressed and demoralized. again, I you know, I lost my entire art studio in Hurricane Helene. That's a really big grief to me. And it's something that will never have true resolution. It's just a difficult thing thrown at me in life, right? I'm not asking you to cry for me. I just want you to kind of understand that, like, you know.

Whatever is happening in your life as a business owner can have an effect on how you run your business, of course. It can also have an effect on how you receive information as a business owner. I realized the hard way that I was experiencing some PTSD about something I had built and worked on for 20 years, just getting wiped away overnight, right? and so when I started getting blinking red lights indicators in Sunlight Tax about

You know, some programming changes that were becoming clearer I need to make. I started going into panic mode and really actually experiencing some PTSD about my hurricane loss and over applying that knowledge to sunlight tax in a way that was not actually real, right? So this was a moment, and I'm really lucky that I had a coach, a business coach, who helped me see this, where I was like, I'm not helping my business right now.

I'm operating out of panic and from a place of trauma. And this isn't healthy for my clients. It's not healthy for me. It's certainly not a place from which I'm gonna make any good decisions. And so I really deliberately took a hard look and I stepped way back in my business. frankly, just to get healthy again, just to start, you know, going to a therapist and like dealing, dealing with my traumatic loss, trying to separate that.

from my existing business so that I can come back in feeling fresh and you know able to do the hard work of running Sunlight Tax. I'm happy to say that I I feel much better having taken a couple months in slow down mode. and it feels fun again. I actually am finding joy in the process and that to me is an indicator that I'm feeling much better. So I say this to you

As a small business owner, your mental health is the company's health. And it is not something you can just ignore and put on hold. It is something you sometimes, I hope you never get to the point that I got to last spring, but it can sometimes get so blinking red and hot that you really you're gonna be forced to step away from your business. And it's better that it's your choice. Okay. More on the Zen journey of running a small business. Receiving feedback.

Receiving feedback is, I think, one of the most difficult things in a business. it can feel so triggering to get, especially when you are operating, you know, you're one person and you're starting to speak to larger groups of people doing, you know, one to many offerings like to a newsletter, to a social media following, to a podcast following, and you start hearing things,

about things they don't like about your program, things they don't like about you personally. If you're a woman, if you are a a person from a historically marginalized group, you probably get a little more of the personal stuff than than a, you know, straight white man might. This is pretty well documented. I think all of us who are in these groups know that this is true. And it's really important and difficult to sort out

The stuff that is coming from other people that is their issue from what is your issue, something that you actually need to address and fix. And sometimes people are not that nice about the way they give you feedback. And this is really challenging, right? I have often wished that I could have more of a Teflon quality, and I just frankly don't. I just don't. Things stick to me. I absolutely

Hate internet comments. because even though most of the comments I get are really kind and lovely and wonderful and I enjoy them, I do get really nasty, awful comments on occasion, and it makes me hate being on the internet altogether. I know from everybody who's got a large following, a large audience, I know this plagues everyone. I know I'm not alone. And basically, if you look at anybody who's got a big following, that is a person who's endured some.

Really nasty internet hate. And that's hard. It's just awful. you know, sometimes when it's stronger than others, I consider just throwing the whole thing away just because I don't want to receive stuff like that. That's an option, but I think for now it's worth it to me to serve the people that I serve and step around those ugly comments.

I have learned some ways to deal with them though I never like

But even with that said, as a small business owner, you get feedback that just, you know, it is hard to receive feedback in an objective way, just about, that's a change that, you know, that's a misunderstanding or a miscommunication on my part. I'm gonna need to address that. Or maybe my product or service is not serving people where they're at right now. Maybe things are changing.

People are feeling different from how they did a year, two years ago. And I'm gonna need to make some changes. Those are healthy responses to have to the kinds of comments you might get coming in that show you you need to make a change. Sometimes it's really hard to hear because it feels so personal, right? And maybe you feel attachment to the program that you're offering, the service that you're offering, the product that you're offering, and it just feels hard to adjust it.

Maybe all you can think about is how difficult it will be to make a change. So I'm just here to say I don't really have a solution for that other than trying to define a very clear boundary about when you take feedback. I like to separate feedback and input mode from sales mode. I find that when I'm doing a big sales push.

I need to be in the best and brightest energy that I can muster. and it's not a good time to be receiving feedback that can be hard and that can be challenging to just my confidence, right? I want to receive feedback about my programs. I want my stuff to be as good as it can be at all times. I want to be honest and ethical about receiving feedback, but it doesn't mean I have to receive it every day. There can be seasons of feedback.

there can be days of the week of feedback. There can be specific months you dedicate to feedback. You don't have to input that at every moment. This is some hard learning I have had from just being tossed around and derailed from too much feedback at the wrong times in my business.

On a similar note, I think one of the sort of zen spiritual journeys of running a small business are understanding a lot like the serenity prayer, the things you can control and the things you can't control, right? If you are listening to this now, you have probably been affected by higher interest rates. You have probably been affected by tariffs. You have probably seen prices rising.

For the cost of goods of what you offer, right? Not all of those things are within your control. Those are things you have to deal with, but you can't necessarily do much about. Likewise, your clients might be feeling more nervous right now. They might be feeling like they have less discretionary income. They might be feeling like they want to ask more questions about your program because they're being much more selective and careful about where they spend their money.

Those are valid things for any client to do and to feel, but it's hard as a business owner. And so my metric for that is to use a metaphor of a surfer. So I am a surfer on the ocean. I am very much and totally responsible for my business and my body, right? My behavior, my business, what I offer.

Right, the way that people interact with me, I can control that. And so to me, I will wax the surfboard, I might even completely overhaul or replace the surfboard. It is my job to make sure that that surfboard is in the best working order it possibly can be. And also, I might myself, as the rider, need to gain new skills. I need might need to get stronger.

Leg muscles, better balance, right? There are things I can control and I it's my job to control them. But there's the ocean. The ocean is bigger than me, it's bigger than my business. The ocean might be interest rates, it might be climate change, it might be a very challenging and divisive political environment. The ocean is something you are riding. You are riding the waves as they come to you and

What you can do is control how you ride the waves, but you can't stop the waves themselves. And this also sometimes the ocean gets too terrible. Sometimes there's an earthquake and then a tsunami. And like you just might not survive through things that are not your fault at all. And I am here post-Hul Hurricane Helene to tell you that is very much true. And I experienced it myself. but sometimes it does present a new opportunity, and sometimes you can learn.

to change the way that you're riding the waves, the way that you have your surfboard. and I think that's a good thing. Knowing the difference is the key there.

One of the other Zen journeys I have had in my business is about goals. now I know that we're all kind of different on this. I know not everybody is as driven by goals as I am, but man, give me a goal and I'm gonna crush it. Like goals to me are something I become maniacal about and have to meet. So I have learned actually the hard way that I have to actually be careful about setting goals.

And really make sure those goals are in alignment with the life that I want to have. I have experienced earlier in my business when I was having some good success, I set very ambitious revenue goals for myself, right? And I was pretty maniacal about meeting them until the point where I realized, wait a minute, I'm not sure it's actually more important to me to meet this.

revenue goal than to maybe not be working nights and weekends to maybe have a better experience with my family and my daughters and my partner.

Maybe actually it's worth more to me to be available in the evenings. And this revenue goal is going to be have to be balanced with the fact that I don't want to work in the evenings. I want to have dinner with the family. So

That to me has been a big journey. I don't know if you're motivated by goals the way that I am, but to me, it has forced me to put goals into my business that are more personal, especially as a solo owner, where again, a revenue goal is nobody's job but mine. And my personal health and well-being can sometimes be in conflict with it, right? So sometimes I'm dialing back.

strictly business related goals because part of my other goals, personal goals, actually factor in because I'm just one person with one life. And so maybe I'm dialing back a revenue goal because I'm dialing up a life goal of availability and connection with people I love and care.

Happiness is another of these zen pieces of the journey for me.

Something really important I learned in this era that I was making very, very aggressive goals is that happiness doesn't come from meeting a goal. it's satisfying to meet a goal. It can be really wonderful. I'm not saying don't do it, but I have listened to many podcasts, I have talked to many fellow business owners who have met really big

Goals that you might think you want, right? Whether it's a hundred thousand followers on Instagram or a million dollars in revenue, you know, name your really big ambitious goal as a solo business owner, right? The fact is, all of those people, 201, didn't feel happier the day they made a million dollars, the day they got that hundred thousandth Instagram follower. If they were happy before.

They remain happy. If they were not happy before, they remained unhappy. Happiness is not coming from that external source. And so this has been actually kind of a hard lesson as I make goals and try to meet them. Because again, that life balance, this is some of the wisdom that is really coming into play for me as a business owner 10 years in, moving past my 10-year mark as a business. My life.

My happiness, these things actually matter often more than, you know, big audience numbers, big revenue numbers. I wanna have a life that I enjoy. I wanna move through my week having days that feel good and not days that feel awful.

Another thing that I find so important, and and I credit a lot of this to the design world. If you don't know, I had a couple of years that I spent working in an interactive design agency in New York City. And, you know, I was coming in myself at the time as a visual artist. I didn't really have training in the design world, but I was trying to get some. I I love the design world.

And one of the things I learned in the design world was about negotiating and working with clients. I just got to see it happen a lot as we worked on these big contracts. And I realized, you know you can negotiate for what's important to you up front. And a lot of times, like it's not as adversarial as I had thought or been trained to believe it was in the arts. The arts tend to be pretty handshaky and wink, wink, nudge, nudge.

Which does not protect you, right? Pretending everything is done through friendship, pretending all our business meetings are actually getting a drink with friends or having a party is not actually that beneficial to me. I actually prefer saying, this is a business meeting, this is a sales call. I actually like that clarity better. The ambiguity of the art world, frankly.

Bothered me. And now that I've seen it done another way, and especially in the design world, which is creative and does prioritize really top-notch creative work, but in a business context, I've really appreciated that. So I got to witness in this design agency lots of contract negotiation. I myself was doing a lot of contract negotiation. And one of the things I loved was noticing how the contract sometimes was

Wasn't always speaking to really what that person's priorities were. So having empathy for the person that you are serving, that you are working with in the business is so useful to just negotiate well and make everybody feel good walking away. There's lots of ways to get a win-win situation in your business just understanding.

Not just the stated goals, but some of the below-the-surface goals of the person that you're working with. And likewise articulating, being clear about some of the things that are important to you. I'll give you a very clear example. So I give a lot of tax workshops to a lot of organizations. I have spoken to real estate firms teaching independent real estate brokers how to do their taxes.

I've spoken to large membership organizations, granting organizations, universities, you name it. So I'm all the time looking at contracts for these speaking teaching opportunities, right? And the contracts have a lot of common themes, but they're all a little different. A lot of them are taken from boilerplate legal language, right? Written by somebody who's not the person sending it to me. It's like a contract that they use over and over again.

So they'll send me the contract, and sometimes that contract will be really grabby and really aggressive. And who knows what era that was written by what lawyer with what goals, right? It's often not written by the person sending it to me in the first place. But a lot of times I'll read the contract, and yes, I always read the contract. my gosh, I'm so grateful I've never signed a contract I haven't read. But a lot of times it'll say things like,

We own all the intellectual property when you speak with our group. We own it forever and we're gonna record it. And to me, that could kill my business. That could actually threaten my business. And so I I'm never, I'm very careful not to sign a contract that ever has any language like that. But again, I also know that the person who sent me the contract probably doesn't know that was in there and didn't do it with any intention to be unkind or aggressive with me.

So I just come back with them and I say, Hey, this contract looks great, but paragraph five says that you would own everything that I say and that you can record it. And I just can't sign that. So it, you know, just change that and then we're good, right? So it's really in good faith. And it's really just stating out loud, like, I have this thing that's really important to me that would be hamstrung by agreeing to this. And I

gonna need you to shift that in order to move forward. I've actually never had anybody push back when I did that. Sometimes it's really, really easy and they can make a same day change and it's simple. Sometimes they have to go through some hoops and like send it to the university's lawyer and it takes a while. And I just sit tight and I say, thanks for changing it. You know? Like

It doesn't have to be antagonistic and that's one of the most wonderful parts of negotiating that I have learned and really loved. That like people often don't know what's in their contracts and you can just say what you want. Just say what you want. Be clear.

The last thing, the last point I wanna bring up on the Zen journey of running a small business is about ethics.

I want to say this specifically because I come out of the world, that is very adverse to money and adverse to capitalism. And so I have been around a lot of people who feel suspicious of taking money. They sort of want and seek out an indirect relationship with that. This can happen in the world of nonprofits, this can happen in the world of the arts.

because these are places where people don't orient on a sort of like business mindset orientation. I'm not saying that's good or bad, I'm just saying these are cultures that exist. And

I've seen a lot of people kind of prefer to set up things where they're asking for a donation rather than to say, you are paying me and I am delivering this thing. But I want to say that over time my thinking has really evolved on this to a point where I love and prefer the ethics and accountability of a direct relationship with the person who is paying you.

And what you are giving them directly, how you serve that person who is giving you a payment. I actually have found that when you triangulate, right, when it's a donation that goes over here, when there's a board involved, sometimes this can corrupt that accountability relationship in a way that is not productive. What I love as a business owner is that I

make an offering. I offer services, maybe products sometimes, and it I'm very clear.

Again, this is where clarity is important. I am clear about what is inside. That is the ethics on my side. I need to be clear about what is on offer and what I will deliver and any parameters there or restrictions that the person buying needs to know. That is my ethical duty as a business owner. Their duty is to look at what's offered, see what the restrictions are.

note if it feels like a fit or not a fit to them and they make the decision if the value that I give, those items that I'm offering are worth the dollars to them. And to some people it will be worth it and to others it will not. In economics there's a whole term and study of this called the cost curve. A cost curve is this plot, this graph that you can make about who in a population is willing to pay X tiny amount for something.

And who is willing to pay Y super high amount. And you can plot sort of how this tends to fall onto a curve with some few people willing to pay a whole lot for a certain item because it has a special amount of value. And then there's a whole world of looking into why those people value with things that way. And some people who could kind of take it or leave it, they'll only get it if it's really cheap, right? And so there's a whole economics about picking prices.

Along that curve and who you're serving and what the psychology is and who's perceiving the value in a different way, right? So I love that ethical call and response relationship where it's very direct. And then you deliver what you said you were gonna deliver, they pay what they said they were gonna pay, and everybody can walk away having been very clear about what was involved in that transaction and feeling like it happened well.

This is the accountability that I really particularly love in an ethical small business and I think I wanna leave you with because I think it is kind of a little bit of magic.

If you're interested, I could talk more about that ethical two-sided equation because it also really steps into things like pricing and demonstrating value and clarifying where you do and don't do things, like actually showing what you need as the business owner and what you expect from the client. there's lots there to dig into.

But just to close, what I want to bring you back to is just a reminder about who I serve and why. It's you. It's people who are on this journey with me. I don't know if you have felt this sort of spiritual or ego pull that I have in running a small business. the highs and lows of it, the difficulty, the strength building of it.

I hope you have, and I would love to hear about your journey. Definitely feel free to send me a message. you can reach out at it @sunlighttax on Instagram and drop me a line or hello@sunlighttax.com. but I'm curious if you have felt this kind of zen or this kind of spiritual journey that I have in running a business. I find it very difficult, but in the most gratifying way.

A lot like lifting weights.

And one of the things that I find the absolute most gratifying about it is getting to serve people like you. I am not the only person out there who really cares about doing deeply good work, excellent, excellent work, and serving people who I find to be kind, caring, ethical, and doing good work in this world. It's the whole reason that I've built my company Sunlight Tax. The point is to

Support and amplify the amazing work that you do by, in my case, helping you just set up the technical side, the scary stuff that can derail you, like audits, legal obligations, kind of knowing what you need to do on the technical side, so that can just stop being a headache and stop being in your way and just exist there as a structure to support you as you go on to do that amazing work that you do. The way that you operate.

Matters. Who you serve matters. How you serve matters. Honestly, you matter. So I hope you've enjoyed that little zen journey of a small-scale capitalist. let me know what you think. And if you're interested, you can probably sense as I talk about this that I am I am on a journey.

right now, right at this moment, I'm doing a lot of work behind the scenes to build a new offering, which is a two-day intensive to help set up your business. It's really different. And I'm trying to, you know, respond to all that feedback that I took in in the last few months and build something that feels really useful, really useful and really valuable to you as a small business owner. So if you want to check out what's involved in that intensive, if you want to sign up for the wait list.

There's no commitment. You join the wait list. you don't have to join. But you will get notified when I do open the doors. So if you're interested in just checking out what the intensive is about, who it's for, how it will work, and you want to get on the wait list to be notified when it's open, you can go to sunlighttax.com/waitlist. All right, you wonderful human being doing amazing work in this world. I'm so happy to connect with you.

Thanks for listening today and I will see you next week. Bye.

Set Up Your Business Intensive: Behind the Scenes

Listen and Subscribe Here

In this episode of the Sunlight Tax Podcast, I explain how self-employed people, including freelancers, creatives, consultants, and small business owners—can build simple, effective tax and legal systems for their businesses. I also introduce a new 2-day intensive program designed to help you set up your business structure, organize your taxes, strengthen legal compliance, and create a clear plan for moving forward.

With personalized guidance, practical tax planning, and community support, this intensive is designed to make the often-overwhelming process of setting up your business feel simpler, more manageable, and more human.

Also mentioned in today’s episode:

02:04 Who I serve: Creative and non-creative small business owners

05:12 Common overwhelm and challenges faced by self-employed individuals

07:08 Choosing the right business entity and legal setup

08:44 Understanding quarterly taxes and avoiding surprises

09:51 The importance of trust and accuracy in tax information

12:04 Details of the two-day intensive format and community aspect

13:57 One-on-one guidance and privacy considerations

15:33 Risks of AI hallucinating tax law and how to get reliable info

16:54 Features of the new program: database, implementation, and support

18:46 Invitation for feedback and how to join the waitlist

20:56 Matching cohorts by business stage and profession

If you enjoyed this episode, please rate, review and share it! Every review makes a difference by telling Apple or Spotify to show the Sunlight Tax podcast to new audiences.

Episode Links:

Join the 2-Day Business Setup Intensive Waitlist

Check out my program, Money Bootcamp

Get my Tax Help on Substack

Get your FREE visual guide to tax deductions

Order my book: Taxes for Humans: Simplify Your Taxes and Change the World When You’re Self-Employed

Watch YouTube video version

Transcript:

Hannah Cole (00:07)

Hello beautiful. I hope you're doing well today.

I don't know about you, I want to talk to those of you who are listening to this podcast. I'm curious. I know some of you listen to this podcast, and you might hear me talk about creative people or artists, and you might not actually identify that way yourself. I certainly know a lot of people listening for

What to me is the real purpose of this podcast is because you're an ethical person, a caring person, someone who is trying to do good work in this world. And you find that the way that I describe tax information or career issues for a small business kind of speaks to you, right? That's actually to me the point. I know that I've had the experience of talking to people who I think are my perfect client, who I could help so effectively.

Who think that they're not somebody that I serve because they're not creative. And I just want to speak to that explicitly right now. I think that that message has gotten out there because of my background. Yes, I went to art school, I've been an artist for a long time, but I'm a small business owner. and who I serve is other small business owners. Now, a lot of them do happen to be creative, and that is because so many design schools and art schools.

Ask me to teach tax workshops that a lot of my audience does end up being in the creative side of the world. And I love that and I welcome that. But I do explicitly want to make sure you know that Sunlight Tax, my work, my book, is designed for self-employed people of any variety. Really, what I care about is that you are building an ethical business, doing work independently, because independent work is where it's hard.

That's where you need tax help, right? When you work on your own, when you're a freelancer, when you're a consultant, when you have your own business, you have a lot more admin than somebody who has a W 2 and works for someone else, right? And so that is who I serve and why I want to serve you. So I just want to speak explicitly to those of you, those many of you who may think.

That you only belong here if you are a creative person. And I just want to assure you that I love what you do. I explicitly want to help you when you are doing good work of any kind. I will name a couple people who actually I know listen to this podcast who are not doing creative work at all. I have many people who I have served over time in fields outside creative fields, and I I explicitly want to call you in.

So if you are, for example, an endocrinologist who works on contract, if you just got your master's in human resources and you are starting a new company to help small businesses set up human resource policies. if you are a therapist engaged in ketamine-assisted therapy,

Maybe you're a therapist who's beginning to venture into the world of executive coaching. I have a lot of coaches in my orbit and a lot of healthcare professionals. Maybe you're a doula or a midwife. maybe you are, like my own partner, a software engineer who just quit his day job in order to take on independent projects that light your fire that drive

a mission that helped the world. You are sick of helping San Francisco based startups just make more money. And now you want to help Asheville. Now you want to help small ethical businesses around the country and especially local to Asheville do things that help their business. So it's really funny to me that my own partner actually recently took a huge step and became

my ideal client. So I just want to explicitly call that in, so that you know that this is a place where not only can I serve you, but I really want to.

I know when you are self-employed, it can feel really hard. You are so busy, you're often overwhelmed with so many tasks of admin that the last thing you want to do is spend time setting up bookkeeping, setting up tax systems, thinking about whether you need an LLC or not, whether you need to be an S corporation or not.

Figuring out sales tax and how to set up for that, right? Those things feel hard, even though they are necessary. You recognize they're necessary, but you're really nervous about sinking a lot of time into them, or sitting with an accountant who just seems to speak in jargon and just wants you to pay them a lot of money, but doesn't explain anything to you and you have no personal understanding of what is going on, right?

You want kind of a balance of like.

Okay, I get it. I know what that's for. I know why I'm making this choice. You want that power. You want to feel empowered in that way. But you also just want to get it done, right? You're not there to like, okay, I don't need a degree in this. I just want to be following the law. That's it. I want to not get audited. I want to not have someone sue me and have no protection, right? That's what you want. So

You probably recognize that you have these needs when you're self-employed, freelance, starting a new business, maybe even shoring up an existing business. You need to track your income. You need to track your tax deductions. You want to get every penny that you can, and you should. You want to make sure you choose the right entity. LLC, S Corp, Partnership, C Corporation, Sole Proprietorship. These are all good options. They don't all do the same thing.

Set up for sales tax, know that if you need a business license that you get it, right? There are a lot of those technical items and you want help, but you really just want to get it done quickly, right?

I also really want to say that one of the most critical times in business setup and getting up to speed quickly, like not trying to just DIY everything and slowly figure it out, is when you are, like my partner, leaving full-time work as a W-2 employee and venturing out onto your own, right? Maybe you're now, you know, you quit a day job and now you're becoming a consultant.

if you are doing that, you can hit a tax whammy really quickly, right? That is when estimated quarterly taxes are going to apply to you right away rather than ramp up gradually as a small business starting from zero is gonna have. And so you in particular need a nice quick setup and you need to understand what is coming before that quarterly tax bill hits you in the face.

And I say this with a lot of experience being the tax practitioner who tells people, hey, you didn't pay any quarterly taxes last year, even though you were obligated to under the law. And now you owe a tax bill that is really big, a lot bigger than you expected. And I'm sorry to tell you this, but if you'd been paying quarterly taxes, you would have saved yourself all of this pain, right? Rather than be the person who says that, I would rather teach you.

how to get on top of your quarterly taxes and avoid that horrible problem you might get at tax time if you don't.

So I understand that you're busy. I understand that you may feel overwhelmed with this technical side and be impatient to get to that good work that you do, serving the people that you serve, making that product that you make, fulfilling that mission that you have, right? That's the purpose of going out on your own or building a business that you love, right? It is to serve those people that you want to serve to fulfill that mission. It's not to get all down and dirty with tax law, right?

You want someone like me to make it easy for you. And with that in mind, I want to tell you how I am shifting my offering to serve you better in a world where you may be feeling a lot of overwhelm, a lot of information glut, and a sense of, I just want to do this as quickly as I can. I want to have results, I want to have it done, right? You don't want a lot of information that you have to weed through and sort through on your own.

You want to actually get the thing done. And you also want to know that you can trust it because AI hallucinates tax law and is actually not very good at math equations, especially tax ones, where it might draw from old and out-of-date tax law or even make up tax rules altogether. so you also need to know that you can trust it, and that is where, as a licensed tax professional, my obligation to stay up to date with tax law and give you the latest.

Is really really important. So here's what I am picturing. I say this to you to preview it, yes, to get you excited, but also for your feedback. If this feels like a program that you'd be interested in, please get in touch. Ask me questions. Tell me specifically what you're looking for, what you hope to see. Because I am building this right now as I talk to you today.

I wanted to feel responsive to what you need. I have been interviewing clients all summer to get this information, to build the best new offering that I possibly can to serve you where you're at right now. But I'd love to hear from you if I haven't already. Ask me your questions. Tell me your concerns. What is it that you know that I could deliver that you really want to see? Okay.

On Instagram, you can DM me at @sunlighttax. Just send me a DM, ask me your question. I love to just voice memo back and forth with people in the morning on my morning walk. You can also email me, hello@sunlighttax.com. If you're not on Instagram, you're welcome to email me your questions, your concerns, your thoughts, your enthusiasm. Maybe you don't feel enthusiastic. But here's what I'm envisioning: I am picturing a cohort.

A small group, a limited group, 10 to 20 people, nice and small, nice and intimate, small enough that you can get to know everybody in it and actually start to feel a network with them, start to feel support, start to realize that other people are going through the same issues that you are, and realize that you have a group that has its own wisdom and resources to draw from. I have found this personally very valuable in programs I have been in in the past.

I have business friends I met that way who I still call for advice. It's absolutely wonderful. This has not been a part of my program to date, and it's something I personally have been longing for. and I really I think the need for community is so strong right now. I'm feeling it, and I just I want to have more connection with the people who I'm serving. So it's gonna be a small group program.

It's gonna be intense and it's gonna happen in two days. Okay. So it's not just an endless program, it's not a year, it's not a long timeline. It's two days and you get it done. The focus is less on an information dump and more on implementation. It's a done with you intensive, right? So it's a mix of me teaching and some group learning and then also implementation time.

Where you do the thing that we just talked about. And you do it with me there to support you as you go. All right. Another component that I think is super important, especially because I am a tax expert and taxes, your specific tax information, your specific tax questions, your income numbers, these are things that should rightfully remain private.

This is not information I ever want you to bring up in a group session. And so deliberately, part of what I'm planning is that you get two one-on-one consults with me. One before the intensive begins, one after the intensive ends. And this way you can come in having already gotten one-on-one guidance from me, maybe doing a little pre-work if that is necessary for you.

And then also knowing that you'll have another consult at the end after you know all the things, after you've done all the things. So that if you have any trip-ups, if you have any things come up as you go, if you have any weird outlier questions that didn't get answered in the intensive, you know you have the time, the space, the privacy to get my eyes on your question. Okay? So I think that is a really valuable part of this intensive.

That it's a small group cohort with intimacy, with community, but also a component of one on one guidance for me.

Also, and I'm really excited about this part. I think information overload is real. I know that a lot of you sit and ask your tax questions of AI, and I think you know that's probably not great, but I'm here to tell you specifically why that is not great. AI hallucinates tax law. It has made up tax rules. It still makes up tax rules. All of the programs.

Have instances where they have made up information that is simply not true. This is breaking the law when it comes to taxes. You need to be so careful because your signature on your tax return says that you have done the due diligence to know that everything in it is correct. This is why AI is really dangerous when it comes to taxes. I know you're using it. That's okay. That's not my complaint. What I want is for you to have a place to get tax information you can trust.

I am a licensed tax professional. I stay up to date on tax law. That is a requirement of my license. Another requirement of my license is due diligence, right? AI has no due diligence requirement. And so it'll just tell you crazy things that make no sense, that are not real, and it will confidently tell you that it's true. So one of the things that my new program includes is a database, a searchable database.

of my content where you can put in your question and it will not summarize, it will not make it in its own words. It will bring you directly to the spot in the transcript and in the video where I am teaching that very thing that you're asking about and it will give you my answer in my words. This I think is really valuable because this way you know you have a way on your own time

At three in the morning when you wake up with a panic attack to ask your tax question and get a real tax answer that you can trust. Okay. And that part is yours forever. I love that. I'm really excited about that piece of this new program. So the idea is that in two days you get your tax system set up. So your receipt tracking, your tax documents.

set up a tax layer on top of your bookkeeping so that you track all the special categories to make tax time extra, extra easy. You understand how to pay your quarterly taxes. we do a session on paying your estimated quarterly taxes so that you know and practice making a calculation and making that payment and knowing how to do that every single quarter when you're gonna have to do that.

and also knowing the legal and business setup that you need for your business. So what are the business license requirements? LLC requirements, S Corp, do you need to have that? Should you have that? You know, is it okay to be a sole proprietor to have a Schedule C? I answer all of those sort of business setup questions. So you choose the right entity.

and you know how to move forward with all the licenses and legal and tax boxes checked that you need to. So the idea is this is two days mix of teaching and co-working, teaching and implementation, sandwiched by one-on-one time where you get individual attention from me and a database of tax reliable searchable answers for your tax questions in the middle of the night.

I think this is a really awesome program. I'm super excited about it and I would love to hear your questions, your feedback, your thoughts about things you wish to include, questions about what it might include, suggestions possibly. So I'd love to hear from you at this stage as I'm building it out. because this is to serve you, right? And I want you to know that yes, absolutely, if you're running a creative business, you are absolutely welcome as always.

But explicitly, if you are a person who is running a small business, working as a consultant, working on your own, who is not creative, you are welcome here. This is absolutely for you.

I also want to mention have had in my programs in the past a component of tax law updates, a calendar of tax deadlines, ongoing support, monthly coworking, monthly check-ins. That ongoing component is really cool and really awesome. It's, I think, a good idea, but not everybody wants it. And so I have disconnected that from this intensive so that the intensive, you are one and done, one shot.

Two days you are done. If you want to at any time join in a year-long year of guidance and get that sort of year-round prompting from me, you can do that also in addition. You can opt into that. But it's not required. It's there as a service to you if that feels valuable to you. So just to let you know that that is also there, that exists. But this program is just, you will be done.

In two days. Okay.

Again, I would love to hear what you think of this. I would love to hear your questions about this. If you feel like it would fit you, if it would not, if it's right for you, if you just want to talk about like how you wish it would be, there's things you'd love to see. I'm really open to hearing that right now. I would love to hear from you. So DM me at @sunlighttax on Instagram or email me hello@sunlighttax.com. Love to hear from you. I am hoping to

Have this ready to show you in the fall. and I cannot wait until it's all built and get you really excited for this new program that's gonna get you all set up in just two days. also if this just sounds good, if you don't have questions, if you're just ready and this sounds great and you're interested,

Just go ahead and sign up on the wait list. I have a really easy wait list form on my website. Just go to sunlighttax.com/waitlist, or I will put a pop-up on the website just so that you can remember. If you go to sunlighttax.com, you can see it there and you can just say, yes, I'm interested. That way I'll know to notify you when this program is ready. I also want to say, depending on the demand,

One of the things that really excites me is knowing what kind of business and what stage of business you're in. Because since I'm running this in cohorts, what I would love to do is group it together with people who are dealing in a similar stage and dealing with similar types of business. Maybe you are in the health and therapeutic professions. Maybe you are a content creator.

Depending on how big the demand is, I am hoping to group people into cohorts with their peers. And this I think can be extra valuable for you. So it's optional as you sign up for the wait list to tell me what you're what field you're in, what profession, but it's really helpful to know that I've got, you know, a critical mass of like people in the healthcare doula therapy world.

so that we can create a health specific cohort. Or if you are likewise in the moving from full-time work into full-time consulting, full-time self-employment, that's a really critical moment. And I would love to group a group of people like that together. So if you want to give me that information to help me match you with people who I think you would do even better with, all the better.

But that's up to you. Okay, thanks for listening. Please tell me what you think. Remember to DM me at @sunlighttax on Instagram. Send me an email hello@sunlighttax.com or just join the wait list at sunlighttax.com/waitlist. And I can't wait to tell you more. And I can't wait to launch this new venture to serve you well in this world and help you get that amazing ethical work that you do amplified in this world.

Because that's the point, after all. All right, thanks for listening. See you next time.

Stacy Ennis: The Power of Nonfiction: How a Book Can Advance Your Business Mission, Leadership & Values

Listen and Subscribe Here

“If you really focus on the reader and creating something meaningful and impactful and excellent... it has longevity and shelf life and continued work to do out in the world well beyond you.”

— Stacy Ennis

In this episode of the Sunlight Tax Podcast, I sit down with Stacy Ennis to explore what it really takes to write and publish a nonfiction book that grows your business, strengthens your brand, and creates lasting impact. We discuss the publishing process, book coaching, traditional publishing vs. self-publishing, and why integrity, strategy, and a clear message matter more than simply getting a book into the world.

Stacy shares practical insights from years of helping authors craft books that not only sell, but also make a meaningful difference—offering valuable guidance for anyone considering writing a business book or becoming a published author.

Also mentioned in today’s episode:

00:10 Introduction to Stacy Ennis and her background

01:00 Stacy's journey from childhood reading to publishing expert

02:36 Her experience in publishing and ghostwriting

03:24 Working with authors with a bigger mission

04:49 The ROI of writing a book and trust building

05:56 Trusting Stacy's expertise after a trust-breaking experience

07:43 The importance of mission and impact in writing

09:04 The strategic value of a book for influence and marketing

10:33 Shelf life and longevity of well-done work

12:24 Reflections on the author journey and publishing routes

14:36 Exploring traditional, self, and hybrid publishing

16:36 The evolving landscape of publishing and author education

18:24 Why hybrid and self-publishing are viable options

20:28 The role of a book in business, trust, and influence

24:18 The transformative process of organizing ideas

27:37 The impact of writing on personal and business growth

28:58 The importance of creative health and deep thought

31:16 Rebuilding self-trust through the writing process

32:44 The societal and professional importance of authorship

33:01 Stacy's resources and podcast

If you enjoyed this episode, please rate, review and share it! Every review makes a difference by telling Apple or Spotify to show the Sunlight Tax podcast to new audiences.

About Stacy Ennis:

Stacy Ennis is a best-selling author, book coach, and speaker on a mission to help leaders clarify their ideas and harness their unique story to make an impact. Her background includes impacting more than 100 books in her 17-plus years in publishing; ghostwriting for a Nobel Prize winner in medicine; and leading as executive editor of Sam’s Club’s Healthy Living Made Simple, a publication that reached around 11 million readers. Stacy’s work and writing have been featured in Yahoo!, Inc., Insider, Publisher’s Weekly, Katie Couric, and the TEDx stage. Stacy is also the host of the podcast Beyond Better and holds a master’s in writing and editing from the University of Cincinnati.

Check Out Stacy Ennis’ Work:

10 Things You Should Know Before Writing a Nonfiction Book free resource

Author Influence Circle

Direct link to book a call with Stacy to chat about their book

Instagram @stacyennis

LinkedIn: Stacy Ennis

Study mentioned on the episode

Episode Links:

Check out my program, Money Bootcamp

Get my Tax Help on Substack

Get your FREE visual guide to tax deductions

Order my book: Taxes for Humans: Simplify Your Taxes and Change the World When You’re Self-Employed

Watch YouTube video version

Transcript:

Hannah Cole (00:07)

Stacy, welcome to the Sunlight Podcast. Stacy Ennis is a best-selling book author, book coach, speaker on a mission to help leaders clarify their ideas and harness their unique story to make an impact. Her background includes impacting more than a hundred books in her 17 plus years in publishing, ghostwriting for a Nobel Prize winner in medicine.

And leading as executive editor of Sam's Club's Healthy Living Made Simple, a publication that reached around 11 million readers. Stacy's work and writing have been featured in Yahoo! Inc., Insider, Publishers Weekly, Katie Courick, and the TED X stage. Stacy is the host of the podcast Beyond Better and holds a master's in writing and editing from the University of Cincinnati. Stacy, welcome to the Sunlight Tax Podcast.

Stacy Ennis (00:56)

Thanks, Hannah. I've been really looking forward to talking with you.

Hannah Cole (01:00)

Yay, me too. What a delight. Will you just give us a little bit of the journey? Like how we've we've heard your bio and where you are now. Can you tell us a little bit about that journey and how you got to where you are today?

Stacy Ennis (01:15)

well, like most people in publishing, I have a a love story with books and writing that started when I was seven. with reading The Chronicles of Narnia. That was my like fall in love with books series. of course The Babysitters Club, all kinds of different books that at the time I didn't really realize this, but growing up in Boise, Idaho, which people call Whiteho, it's 87% white, very affluent.

It was a very homogeneous space to grow up and my books gave me a sense of the world. It helped me develop a mindset beyond where I was, empathy through other people's stories. So it was kind of my first world exploration was through reading books. And you know, fast forward a long time, I went and got my bachelor's in in writing. And then shortly after that, my husband and I moved to the Dominican Republic. We weren't

married at the time, but we moved to the Dominican Republic and then Vietnam, came back and went to grad school for writing and editing. And along the way I was I started working in publishing. I as you mentioned I I ghostwriter for a Nobel Prize winner for four years. I also used to run Sam's Clubs magazine, Healthy Living Made Simple. We had about 11 million readers. I was executive editor of that publication, which of course was a a huge and important role and taught me so much about the publishing industry.

and so I've spent most of my career in well, I spent all of my career, I should say, in the written word in some capacity, and as an editor, as a ghostwriter, and today as a book coach. So I I work with authors or future authors who want to write a nonfiction book. That's a space that I operate in. And I would say, you know, particularly in work with authors that have a vision beyond the book. So

The book is not their end all be all goal. They have a reason they're putting this book out into the world, whether it's a business goal or a social mission or something that's bigger than the book. And I get to work with really amazing people. It's it's the coolest work.

Hannah Cole (03:24)

I love it. I agree with you. It is. and I've noticed because I am in your membership program, the author's influence circle, and the other people in there are really cool. Like everybody is trying to make the world a better place in their from

Stacy Ennis (03:37)

Yeah.

Hannah Cole (03:37)

their specific vantage point and that makes me thrive.

Stacy Ennis (03:42)

Yeah, and the and they're actually doing things to do that. You know, like they're out there, you know, doing their good work, whatever shape that takes in the world. And I think that is a a real hallmark of the kind of clients that I love to work with. They're action takers, they're big dreamers, but they're not just talking about what they'd like to do. They're actually taking action toward toward their dreams and their bigger vision.

Hannah Cole (04:07)

Mm, I love it.

So Stacy, I did mention this in our session together, the ROI of writing a book. But I do wanna just say for those people who are listening to the podcast and weren't in that session, by the way, if you wanna get

the recording for that ROI of writing a book. If you just join my Substack, it's free for subscribers. So you can either send me a note through Substack that you're a subscriber and you'd like that recording, or you can send an email to hello@sunlighttax.com So everybody who missed the ROI of writing a book session with Stacy, you're so welcome to have it. Okay, so what I wanted to say is just like I had this experience with you, Stacy, that I want to say to everybody because

It made it really made me trust in your expertise, like trust in your deep wisdom. You're n not only are you an incredible writer, I mean you cannot how many books have you written? Seventeen.

Stacy Ennis (05:01)

Yeah, eight

eighteen. Yeah. I'm working on the nineteenth right now. Yeah.

Hannah Cole (05:05)

Good Lord. yeah, you can't do that without being

of a not just a good writer, but somebody who's really mastered the process, right? but I had this experience because I had a book deal, I suddenly had a book deadline, super exciting, and I went out and I hired a book coach just on somebody's recommendation. She was kind of new and a little green, I think.

and I had an awful experience. I'm not gonna name her, but I had an awful experience, very trustbreaking, very yucky. and I called you Stacy because you know, you you had a lot of experience, and I just I had like an SOS call with you. And I just want to say for everybody listening, like Stacy's generosity was unbelievable. She was just like, just there to kind of hold my hand through one of frankly many.

book crises. and it was so evident to me that not just is she a fantastic writer, but that she really knows the publishing world and the book writing journey and process and also the strategy around like placing your book in the world. and I just can't tell you how held I felt by just that SOS call with her, which is why I then joined her membership. And like, so I just wanna, I just want to put that out there because I really think you're

Work is incredible, Stacy.

Stacy Ennis (06:24)

Thanks, Hannah. I don't even know what to say, but thank you. That was so kind.

Hannah Cole (06:30)

yeah, no, I think it I think it's important. I mean, I know y you have to build your own trust with people, but I really do feel like, wow I I like saw you when it was hard for me, through a crisis and and it mattered. It made a difference.

Stacy Ennis (06:44)

Maybe, you know, one thing I'll I'll layer into that experience. yeah, I'm sorry that you had experience with the the first coach and I think that like this is a problem in our industry that we have a lot of people out there that are not qualified really to be guiding people on these journeys or make kind of big

promises or just give bad advice. And that's not the standard. Like like most places, most people have really good intentions and care a lot. But it is it is tough when you have those experiences and

I think that that's why conversations like this and the episode that you did also on your journey, Hannah, which you you published a little bit earlier, these types of things that we're doing are so important for people that are considering this journey so they can avoid some of what you went through. But then I also just wanna lift up your resilience and like ultimately with your work.

you came back to your service through your work. And I think that's what really held you through that period because this is why I mentioned at the top, I work with authors whose end goal is not the book. The the the go the book is a a vehicle, a catalyst to do something in the world.

And I

Hannah Cole (08:00)

Mm.

Stacy Ennis (08:00)

think part of why you were able to, you know, dust yourself off and find your way forward is because you had a mission that was bigger than that road bump.

Like you were going to traverse that road bump because you cared deeply about the reader on the other side of that. And you cared so much about making it useful and excellent. And that's the that is really what

makes a great book at the end of it. Of course there's people that support you and guidance you can get, but I think that the mindset that you had is ultimately why your book ended up becoming great at the at the when all is said and done.

Hannah Cole (08:41)

I appreciate that so much. you know, I really I felt like going in. You tell me how good this strategy is, but my strategy going in was like, I'm not Michelle Obama. I do not have a massive platform. It's gonna be uphill the whole time to kind of get the word out about this book. PS is still available and it's still great. Everybody.

Stacy Ennis (09:04)

Yeah.

Hannah Cole (09:05)

but I just figured like

really my best friend in this process, the only way this book was really gonna do as well as I think it deserves to do is if it was so good that people would want to tell their friends. And so I

Stacy Ennis (09:20)

Yeah.

Hannah Cole (09:20)

really felt focused on this has to be the best book to teach a self employed person how to manage their taxes, like how to set up their business and like not get tripped up by the IRS. so that

Stacy Ennis (09:32)

Yeah.

Hannah Cole (09:33)

that really was my vision and

Yeah, it just was like I wanna be able to also like when you're marketing and doing the sales stuff, if like me, that's not your favorite part of the company you run.

Stacy Ennis (09:47)

Why ever not?

Hannah Cole (09:50)

I feel like I do a much better job marketing something that I know is actually the best, right? And so I just wanted to be able to feel that way about my book, which I'm ha happy to say that I do. But I don't know, you

Stacy Ennis (10:05)

That's huge.

You gotta be in love with the the work or else you're not yeah, you're not gonna wanna show up. And I think just to feel really proud of what you did is important, an important result of all of this. And your book, I mean, I know tax code changes, so there's probably gonna be updates and iterations that you'll provide, probably also on your website, which is a great way to keep people engaged with your platform. But even, you know

Even books that have some aspect of them with a shelf life can serve you for so long. I just, my co-author Ron Price and I just won an award, I think it was either earlier this year or the end of last year, for a book that we published in 2018. So I mean it gives you a sense of

Hannah Cole (10:51)

Wow.

Stacy Ennis (10:52)

the the longevity of well done work. If you really focus on the reader and creating something meaningful and impactful and excellent.

Like it has longevity and shelf life and, you know, continued work to do out in the world well well beyond you.

Hannah Cole (11:09)

Hm. Yeah, I appreciate that. Also, congrats on your award. How exciting.

Stacy Ennis (11:13)

Thanks. It was so cool. I was like,

wow. You know, it was very unexpected.

Hannah Cole (11:18)

That's awesome. Yeah, I did a lot of strategizing about how to write an Evergreen tax guide. I didn't I knew I didn't want it to go out of date in a year and it does not. I

Stacy Ennis (11:26)

Yeah. They need some shelf life.

Hannah Cole (11:28)

yeah, it needs shelf life. So I put QR codes to get the updated number on every single thing where I actually name a number. I give ballparks where it's not necessary to give an exact number. So it is evergreen.

Stacy Ennis (11:41)

It's wonderful.

It's so smart. And I it's especially in the financial space, that's very hard to do.

Hannah Cole (11:47)

Mm-hmm.

Stacy Ennis (11:47)

but you you know, you approach that really thoughtfully. It also brings people into your ecosystem so you can serve them better through, you know, a future book or future offerings or anything that comes up.

Hannah Cole (11:59)

For sure. So tell me, I it y I know you listened to my episode where I talked about how I broke down the like the author journey of publishing a book. And you know, of course I'm an I'm an experience of one and you have experience. You have so much more exponentially more author journey experience. So I'm kind of curious reflecting on my interpretation of that journey, what you would what you would add to it.

Stacy Ennis (12:24)

Hmm. I listened with great interest. I was very interested in hearing your experience and you know, insights from there there is something to be said also about having been in this so long and having such a wide range of experience that I n will never get to approach it for the first time again. Like you get to have that experience. So I also get to learn from you in in your journey and your experience. It helps me help.

other authors as well. So I got a lot out of it. I highly recommend everybody to go listen to that. I think that the layer that I would maybe add to your experience is that you took the traditional publishing route. And that is definitely not all that's available for authors to to consider as their pathway to publishing. And I would particularly highlight underrepresented authors. We have a very white

not very diverse industry that gatekeeps books. And although there's been a lot of growth and change within publishing, it's still a very antiquated industry like many are, and has a lot of room to grow. So, you know, authors of color, queer, disabled authors, you're just gonna have a harder time than like a white female or a white male who's out there

Trying to get picked for these opportunities. And so I I think that it's really important for authors to know that the gates can be opened by you through different routes. And yet, while we have more access through self-publishing and hybrid publishing, you as an author, especially if you're not working with a really reputable publishing partner like a hybrid publisher.

you now need to take on many of the things that Hannah talked about, that Hannah that you talked about in your episode, around your positioning, really understanding your reader, your market research, your planning. And where I see a lot of authors frankly quit or fail is that they don't do a lot of that early planning outlining. And part of what a book proposal can be really useful for is that planning process.

Hannah Cole (14:36)

Mm-hmm.

Stacy Ennis (14:36)

It's not

always necessary to do that f in the way that you did it, Hannah, if you're going the self-in hybrid publishing route, but you do components of that to prepare yourself for the writing process. So I think that that's just one layer I would add is that there's other routes that you can take. It doesn't have to be the traditional route. Certainly there are pluses to that. There's also minuses to the traditional route, pluses and minuses to self-publishing and hybrid publishing, which is

You know, if that's a new term for people, that's like a kind of middle ground between traditional publishing and self-publishing, where you pay a partner publisher to produce your work. So they are really creating the product, often engaged in the marketing. so there's a lot of routes and I I think that that might be something that's an interesting layer to dig into.

Hannah Cole (15:27)

Yeah. you know, that wasn't my experience, but a lot of people in the author's influence circle which you run are are approaching it that way. And you have a lot to share on that. So I will like those of you listening who resonated with Stacy's message about, you know, if you're hi in a historically marginalized group or just maybe the economics or time, of a book feels

scary to you, I definitely recommend that you go look on Stacy's website and poke around at what she offers because she's really good at this, like, you know, laying out what the journey looks like for the different types like hybrid and self publishing, which are definitely viable viable options and becoming more viable. Would you say

Stacy Ennis (16:09)

Mm-hmm.

Hannah Cole (16:09)

that's correct?

Stacy Ennis (16:11)

yeah. I I recently did a an interview on my podcast, which you've been on, Hannah, Beyond Better. And I interviewed Emma Lowe, who's the director of the London Book Fair, which is one of the largest industry conferences in the world. And one of the things that I thought was really interesting about this fair that I attended back in March, and we talked about on the episode, is that they they have this whole author education.

Component of the London Book Fair. And as part of this kind of wider trade show that they do, they provide author education and they had a lot of authors on stages. They had a lot of education around publishing. What I thought was really interesting is that they had many self-published authors on stage alongside traditionally published authors. Many of them had started traditional and went self-publishing, which I thought was very interesting that they

Hannah Cole (17:03)

That

is.

Stacy Ennis (17:04)

And I really appreciated the way that they gave the space to vr a variety of publishing routes because, you know, especially with a trade show like that that's for it's a deal making conference for traditional publishers. Like that is the the heart of it, especially for translation rights. So by all, you know, accounts, they have every right to highlight and focus on traditional.

But self-publishing, hybrid publishing had a big imprint there. Like imprint, I I guess is a publishing term, but I mean like in a different way. you know, they had

Hannah Cole (17:37)

Yeah. Yeah.

Stacy Ennis (17:40)

a big footprint and were very visible. And in fact, Ally, which is an independent authors organization, ran that whole stage. So I I think that it's, you know, it it's growing, but it's also becoming a preferable route, actually, especially for

genre writers, which Emma mentions in that podcast episode, but for nonfiction, definitely, because a lot of the authors I work with have an integration in their business. And there's a lot of things that you don't get to control in the traditional route. And the time to market is very, very long. So if you have some, you know, business or brand or social impact growth goals, they might not want to wait three years to get the book out into market. They'd rather

you know, take it into their own hands and work on more of like an 18 month timeline, let's say. So there's, you know, there's again always pros and cons. And there's never one right route that I could say is like, this is the way I recommend for every single person. Budget comes into play, goals come into play. you know, do you have like the interest in exploring the traditional route? And like,

Hannah Cole (18:49)

Mm-hmm.

Stacy Ennis (18:49)

is that exciting to you?

And and

Hannah Cole (18:51)

Yeah.

Stacy Ennis (18:52)

if it is, then and you want to go that route, that's wonderful. But I also recommend that people put parameters around that and have a mindset of I'm gonna do this no matter what, like I'm gonna get this work out into the world no matter what. Because if we're always just waiting for somebody else to deem us worthy or to give us an opportunity, like what? We have so much availability to us now to be able to create our own opportunity and and to put our own work out into the world.

Hannah Cole (19:21)

Yeah.

Stacy Ennis (19:22)

so I I just like authors to know that that there's a lot of routes and one is not better or more worthwhile than another. and that you can explore all the different ways to get a book out.

Hannah Cole (19:37)

That's awesome. So to the person who's listening to this who doesn't identify as a writer, but who's, you know, a thought leader, somebody who's built some expertise in their business, presumably serving a population, kind of like me, right? I didn't identify as a writer, but I do a lot of writing and I do have a mission and a thing to teach. Like I think there's a lot of people like that where they might play with the idea of a book, but they feel very uncertain kind of

Does this make any sense? Does it make any sense financially? Does it make any sense like audience wise or business wise? So one of the things I love about you, Stacy, is how you are able to kind of place that within the ecosystem of a business, of somebody who is kind of a leader in their field. Can you talk a little bit about like what kind of a role a book can play and and ROI in terms of yes, money, but audience or other benefits?

Stacy Ennis (20:28)

Yeah, yeah. it's interesting. I I'm prepping for presentation I'm going to provide a speakers group tomorrow. And as

Hannah Cole (20:36)

Mm-hmm.

Stacy Ennis (20:37)

part of that prep I I always like to see what data points I can bring in because that can be really useful. And I came across this report, the name of the the company that did the the

analysis is escaping me, but I can send it to you later, Hannah. Maybe we can link to it if you if you want to. But it's

Hannah Cole (20:53)

Yeah, I thought.

Stacy Ennis (20:54)

on visible experts. So the idea of a visible expert is it's somebody that is, you know, out there creating in a visible way. So they're becoming known in their space. You would be a visible expert, I think, from their definition. And they had these two charts. One chart is most popular marketing things that they do. So it's like

this list of, you know, social media, speaking, referrals, all of these things. And at

Hannah Cole (21:22)

Mm-hmm.

Stacy Ennis (21:23)

the very bottom is writing a business book. Like that was or writing a book on their topic or something like that. The bottom of popularity. But then they had a chart of most effective marketing strategies. And number one was speaking and number two was writing a book on your topic.

Hannah Cole (21:44)

Amazing.

Stacy Ennis (21:44)

and the referrals

were three, I think, in that list. And so while I think in the original list it was like social media was pretty high up, and these other these other things that are maybe a little easier, a little more accessible, they are not the necessarily the most effective when they surveyed this group. I think it was two hundred and fifty visual visible experts. And I thought that was such a cool

data point because it's like anything else. Often the thing that is the effort, it's the bigger thing that's the heavier lift. they're really unpopular. Not everybody wants to do it or will do it. Maybe they want to, but they won't follow through. we know that, you know, about 80% of people want to write a book, but less than 1% of people actually do. And so I think that, you know, a book is such a

Completing and publishing a good book, I think that that's a really important note there. It has to be a good quality, well-done book, can be

Hannah Cole (22:44)

Mm-hmm.

Stacy Ennis (22:45)

such a powerful differentiator for you as whatever you are, a coach, a consultant, a creator of some kind, a service provider, you know, whatever you're out there doing in the world.

so there's there's that one piece from a

just simply a marketing perspective. We know that it's effective and it's long-term effective. It's it has a much higher shelf life, as you know, we talked about that earlier, than a viral reel or even a s a a really great workshop or talk. You have to keep delivering those over and over again as marketing strategies. But a book,

Hannah Cole (23:17)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Stacy Ennis (23:19)

of course you have to market it, of course you have to do the work of getting visibility around it, but it's completed and it's out in the world.

And so there's these pieces that we know a book can deliver. Status, I hate I hate might be a strong way, I strongly dislike that this is part of our human experience, but it is. And we as humans take in signals about people to decide if we can trust them. And a really strong trust status symbol is an author, because you've done that work. it is an access point to rooms and stages that

would previously be hard to get into because you lack that status. there it can be used as a marketing tool, a lead gen tool, you know, podcast pitching tool. Like there's all these things that you can do to really leverage it. And we know

Hannah Cole (24:04)

Yeah.

Stacy Ennis (24:04)

all that stuff, but I I think that the thing that gets talked about less or maybe is less well known is that the experience and journey of organizing your ideas

Not just to organize your ideas, but then translate those in a way that other people can understand, remember, and use. That is a process that you grow in such a deep and profound way and you arrive on the other side of this changed. You you're clearer, you're more confident.

Hannah Cole (24:38)

yeah.

Stacy Ennis (24:39)

Yeah, I'd love to hear from you, Hannah, if that was your experience with your work.

Hannah Cole (24:43)

Yeah, I mean it's the workout of your life. I mean, I kept thinking of it

Stacy Ennis (24:46)

Yeah.

Hannah Cole (24:47)

in terms like that. Like I I I do weight training. I've been like

Stacy Ennis (24:50)

Love that.

Hannah Cole (24:51)

and it it is that it is like you can't do it all in one day. It is a way bigger project. Like you're kind of building your strength over daily writing or or weekly, you know, I mean your pace is your pace. But yeah, it's it's strengthens what you are already expert in. It strengthens and clarifies and

I think I remember a business coach, somebody huge, like Alex Hermozzi or something, was talking about like a little metric of like what you should do in your business. There's like high impact, easy to do, high impact, hard to do, low impact, easy to do, low impact, no impact. you know, doesn't do anything for you. So obviously we forget that quadrant altogether. And he's like, Well, as a business owner, what's left for you?

You've already done this stuff that's high impact and easy to do. The only thing left is either to go to things that won't move the needle or to start doing the hard stuff. Like, and so like

Stacy Ennis (25:49)

Mmm. that's so good.

Hannah Cole (25:51)

high impact, hard to do is something that separates you from the pack. I mean, it is easy to put up an Instagram reel, relatively speaking. And it is not easy to write a book. So of course it's a differentiator.

of course it tells people you're serious, you're committed, because you you can't, you cannot write a book without that. Not to mention the book process itself makes you better at what you do.

Stacy Ennis (26:19)

Yeah, a hundred percent all of what you said. And I and I I think that, you know, because also it's a long journey of introspection and and particularly in this time that we're in globally with the you know AI and all of that, I won't I'm not gonna take us down that rabbit hole. But you know, it is a trained intentionality. Like you have to really show up in deep thought.

And you have to sit with your thoughts and you have to work through those thoughts. And and this is if you do it with with integrity, if you go through this process with integrity, because we now have tools that can steal some of your integrity and your creative process. but if you go through this process with integrity and with a real quest of service and creating something lasting and meaningful and useful and

You know, Hannah, in your episode that you recorded, you talked about, you know, not wanting it to be a big long sales book that's like just sending people to all the things you sell, really making

Hannah Cole (27:19)

Mm-hmm.

Stacy Ennis (27:19)

it an all all contained useful thing. Like that is hard work. That is not an easy thing to do. It requires so

Hannah Cole (27:28)

Mm-hmm.

Stacy Ennis (27:28)

much thought. And so that process of thinking and organizing, I imagine that also impacted other things that you do in your business.

Talks that you're giving, interviews you're giving, maybe I don't know if you've grown any new products or any new like service items out of some of that thinking I I or maybe will. but

Hannah Cole (27:47)

Yeah, a little.

Stacy Ennis (27:48)

that's like it's a seedbed for growth for other personal and and business and brand growth.

Hannah Cole (27:54)

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely true. I think you know what, like just to speak to this moment that we're in right now, one, I think we're in a trust recession. I didn't invent that term and I can't attribute it, but the internet says this.

Stacy Ennis (28:10)

Okay.

Hannah Cole (28:11)

I think a book is a really nice antidote to the trust recession. Like it just takes so much commitment to write one and integrity. I mean, yes, if you if you do it the right way.

That it is in part an antidote to that trust thing. Like you build a trust with someone as they read your book. and I also just want to say on a personal note, like as AI creates all this slop and shallow thinking, I think this is why I feel so attracted to authors and writers lately. I'm a mega reader. Anyone who is

follows my substack knows that I like recommend a book every week and you can tell I'm reading a book a week. But like I'm so attracted to reading and to authors because it's a place for deep thought. It's a place for integrity.

Stacy Ennis (28:58)

Mm, mm-hmm.

Hannah Cole (28:59)

It's a place for like deep, deep human connection. and I don't know about you, but more than ever right now, the AI era is making me more into books because of that.

Stacy Ennis (29:10)

yeah, for sure. And I've definitely the last six plus months I've really moved away from a lot of I mean, I'm still on all the platforms and doing all the things, but I the the the what was it? You said trust recession? Is that what you said?

Hannah Cole (29:25)

Trust your session.

Stacy Ennis (29:26)

That's so good. interestingly, I'm I've been I'm prepping for

a conference later this year here in Portugal. It's called Book 2.0. And I'm moderating a panel. And I was just chatting with Matt of, he founded the London Writers Salon, and he brought up this term called creative health, which is not a term that I'm familiar with, but it's something that apparently a lot of people are curious about and studying and interested in.

And I I love that as a concept because I think as we, you know, we think about all of these areas, mental health, physical health, spiritual health, creative health, it's a real thing. Having space in your day and your life for creative, thoughtful work, I think to your point now more than ever, and as we, you know, it's also like

I think that some authors, future authors, aspiring authors, are are also in maybe a self-trust recession because they're outsourcing so much of their thinking and creative work that they don't trust themselves to create with their own brains anymore. And

Hannah Cole (30:32)

You're so right.

Stacy Ennis (30:34)

So this is something that I'm I'm I'm having calls with a lot of authors who are really nervous about the way that I work and the my guidelines around AI. I and I on pretty much every call, I'm like, listen, not every call, but a lot of them. Listen,

Hannah Cole (30:50)

Mm-hmm.

Stacy Ennis (30:51)

you've been using your brain and only your brain for decades. We have been writing books and creating we've been telling stories for 30,000 years. And we are

capable of creation and in fact your beautiful human brain is completely powered to do this all on its own. And I think that

Hannah Cole (31:15)

Mm-hmm.

Stacy Ennis (31:16)

some of this process of writing a book or whatever it is, creating whatever it is in the world, we're rebuilding that self-trust, like that is just a foundation of self-belief. And yeah, it's important. It's important.

Hannah Cole (31:32)

That's

that's beautiful. I mean, again, strength training has is my metaphor for everything in life, but I would you go to the gym and put your weights on a forklift and have the forklift lift the weights for you? Like you can recognize how that

Stacy Ennis (31:43)

No, no, you wouldn't you'd atrophy. Yeah.

Hannah Cole (31:46)

is not going to build muscle for you. Like

Stacy Ennis (31:49)

Yeah.

Hannah Cole (31:50)

the way to build the powers of your brain is to do the powerful work. Like and it's hard. Like that's the whole point. That's why not everybody does it.

Stacy Ennis (31:59)

And the people that do are the people that are going to outlast all of the

kind of hardships that we are seeing in AI. I think the people that will stay the course and do

Hannah Cole (32:10)

I agree.

Stacy Ennis (32:10)

the thinking, they're going to lead what will be, and I think already starting to be a creative revolution. So I think that there's not just, you know, the virtue of the work, but I think there's a real like professional imperative, a societal imperative, like this is all

it's important. And I think that a book is a very practical expression of that. Like it's a project that you can do that taps into all the things that we're talking about and it also moves your business forward. Like it's

Hannah Cole (32:44)

Yeah.

Stacy Ennis (32:44)

kind of the perfect project in my view. it contains a lot of things.

Hannah Cole (32:47)

my gosh, Stacy creative revolution, the antidote to

what ails society right now. Like, let's leave it there. We can't do better. Amen. I love it.

Stacy Ennis (32:53)

Yeah.

Hannah Cole (33:01)

I I so agree with everything you said. I don't feel like I can do any any better than you just did. So thank you.

Stacy Ennis (33:08)

Ha ha

Hannah Cole (33:10)

Beautiful. And I agree. I'm on this team. Stacy, I I want to point to the session that we did together, and let people know that if if you're interested in hearing Stacy's wisdom, getting down into the nitty-gritty numbers, into the self-publishing thing, to the actual writing journey, if you're starting to think, maybe this is like something I wanna look at.

They can get that the recording of our session by just you just have to be a subscriber. You can just be a free subscriber or paid to my Substack Taxes for Humans. Send an email to hello@sunlighttax.com and just say you want the recording or send me a note on Substack. But with that said, knowing that people can get that, I also want people to just hop on your website, take a look at what you offer because you're really brilliant in many areas.

And I think you've definitely given people a taste of why maybe they might be interested in that. So Stacy, where can people find you?

Stacy Ennis (34:06)

thank you, Hannah. You can find me at stacyennis.com at Stacy with no E. and if you go to stacyennis.com/10things that's the number 10, I have a free guide that you can download, fully created by me with no AI.

that really will give you an overview of things that you need to know before writing your nonfiction book. And this is a guide that has helped so many authors. Even if you don't work with me, I would love for you to get this because it's gonna give you, you know, a really solid foundation. It's like a quick and dirty download of of 10 things that you should really know go before you go into this journey. and I'm also on Instagram at Stacy Ennis and on LinkedIn.

Hannah Cole (34:45)

Lovely. And also your podcast is great, Beyond Better. lots of

Stacy Ennis (34:48)

Yes, and I had a great

episode with this amazing woman named Hannah Cole. So they can go listen to that one.

Hannah Cole (34:54)

Yeah.

Lovely, lovely. It's a great place to explore topic by topic. Stacy, it's just you're brilliant and wonderful. I love the work you're doing. And also like you're serving people who have a mission in this world, help them get their voice out there. That's what I think of myself as doing on the money side. And so I feel very aligned with you and I love the work you're doing. So thanks for being with us today.

Stacy Ennis (35:18)

Thank you, Hannah. I really appreciate the opportunity to connect with your people through this podcast and just through your partnership and collaboration and helping make the world a better place.

Hannah Cole (35:30)

Yeah, let's make great people help great people do great work. Awesome. All right. Well I will see you again in your in your membership and thanks for being here.

Stacy Ennis (35:41)

Thanks, Hannah.